Pictured: Kasabian running errands on Tuesday View gallery The. It's doubtful she would have gotten a California license simply because she had no permanent address and moved around a lot, even from state to state. A couple of days later, she escaped and later returned to her mothers home in New Hampshire along with her daughter. She was the key witness in District Attorney Vincent Bugliosi's prosecution of Manson and his followers for the Tate-LaBianca murders. But kids were revered in the Family which made Tonya safer. Yes, it is common for lawyers to try to project a favorable image of their witnesses, especially a witness as 'key' to the case as Kasabian. Far more than the others that actually went to jail, fingers can be pointed at Linda about how not to conduct one's life. Why not that? No dont stop Dreathwhat happens next ? And it is almost impossible - hell, it is impossible - to cut the guy who proclaimed himself the Devil before butchering nine people any slack. Usually, when I'm reading them, I try to guess who has written them before I get to the end. AustinAnn74 earlier pointed out, regarding Linda, What if she wouldn't have testified? Linda then traveled to Boston, where she married a. HS was something she was getting to grips with. The LicenseThe license is a bit of a red herring. The problem of course is that Bugliosi does not want that answer. Before I graduated my draft lottery number was 289. She turned State's Evidence and received immunity in exchange for her testimony, which was without a doubt, the most damaging to the family. About the license, it had to be expired. She mentioned to the Grand Jury that there were to be 2 death squads. Linda Kasabian After two failed marriages and the birth of her daughter Tanya, Kasabian joined Manson's commune at Spahn Ranch in July 1969. I for one would never accuse Bugliosi of improperly 'coaching' a witness or eliciting perjured testimony. ]MR.KANAREK: Compound, your Honor, leading and suggestive. Why would she put herself though that if she wasn't trying as hard as she could to be honest and get herself out? But Pat's "Rise" and "Death to pigs" is arguably the Family's calling card and one of the main pointers to Charlie. In 1968, the couple's first daughter Tanya was born. Later, Robert Kasabian contacted Linda and invited her to meet him in Los Angeles. But again, while Susan was playing ball, Linda was surplus to requirements.and helping her knock Atkins out of the boxThat's the part I really don't believe. Atkins remembers seeing Pat struggle with Abigail but can't recall the exact sequence of things where she was concerned or how she ended up crawling on the lawn as they were about to leave. Or for purposes of this blog do they show an alternative narrative to what is the official narrative. var part3 = "Deb at Mansonblog dot com"; Could Watson Have Conspired With Suzan LaBerge??? Which scares people in a society where every wants to blame a white man for personal or political gain. The charges against her were dropped when she agreed to attend a drug counselling session. She, like all of us, was/is a flawed person but not totally on the dark side. It'll take a while for me to digest it. LINDA KASABIAN Wally Fong/AP; Bill Hudson/AP THEN After two failed marriages and the birth of her daughter Tanya, Kasabian, 20, joined Manson's commune at Spahn Ranch in July 1969. What if she wouldn't have testified? Two people had spread that around long before Linda herself was even arrested. Also Known As: Linda Darlene Kasabian, Linda Darlene Drouin, Spouse/Ex-: Robert Peasley (m. 1965 div.. 1966). Why? I'm saying a good DA could have convicted them using that tool and yes, Van Houten is the example. Better yet how about asking Dr. Galloway? I don't care if he lived another two hundred years of apparent decency - the amount of evil that he generated in that August month was just to extreme to ever cut him any slack. Linda grew up in the New England town of Milford, New Hampshire. Matt saidAmazing that the defense lawyers never bothered to check on that tidbit during the months and months duration of the trialDuring the trial, she was asked a number of times about her licence. A British rock band is named after her too. At the age of sixteen, she married but it ended in a divorce. "Journey into Darkness" is a good start. The key impact of both crimes is that Conspiracy to Commit Murder and Felony Murder do not require the defendant to actually kill anyone or even be present when someone is murdered to be guilty of murder. Many thanks to you, Dreath. She has been portrayed a number of times in films. She admits to getting into the car and being struck by the body being there but the spirit not. As we all know Linda Kasabian was born Linda Darlene Drouin on June 21, 1949. I am in the class of 1965 picture as a matter of fact. I draw a line at the trials. Leslie told Marvin Part there were to be 2 death squads. AustinAnn74 saidI never thought she was an innocent flower childOf her being a Hippie he commented that "if any witness was ever placed under a microscope, it was Linda Kasabian, and I am convinced that each and every one of you saw the same thing under that microscope, a young hippie girl whose aimless drug oriented life tragically led her to Spahn Ranch, Charles Manson, and two nights of murder ~ two nights of horror"Hippies were not seen as the vanguard of morality or these nice folk that straight society looked to as the shining example of what young people were to be. Linda's daughter, aka "Lady Dangerous" was arrested for possession of a controlled substance (both rock and powder cocaine), and was sentenced to a year in state prison. She was a witness for the District Attorney, Vincent Bugliosi. But it's slippery ground to go with either, if you want to keep Charlie out of all this. I should have found a way and not gone over the fence and run down the hill. Now that said I happen to agree with this opinion: "The mission, ladies and gentlemen, the mission of these defendants on both nights, was murder. If Perry and other legal dramas were like real life in courtrooms, few would watch them !You are trained, instead, to focus on "indicia of credibility and reliability"That's partly why people on trial will dress "respectably." Because the socialist told me to vote for her, despite only weeks earlier being the leader of a revolution against the 1%. Retrospectively however..Linda K. is the perfect choise for examination IF you want to discover a more human side of the Manson Family StoryThat tends to be my chosen angle of approach because for me, it is a very human story, encompassing a large scope of culture, society, rebellion against it, motivation etc. Yes, if you stop at the Grand Jury he has no case against Kasabian as it's inadmissible and/or it was all he had. [STOP right here! Robert,Thank you for the clarification. I have also enjoyed all of the comments related to this postlove all of the insights. Here is a fact: Krenwinkel never said the motive was Helter Skelter. Her contentious relationship with her stepfather eventually led to her dropping out of her high school and running away from her home. They had a second child together, and Robert Kasabian left for South America. Police investigation ? That gave me an insight that Bugliosi & Gentry's book doesn't even hint at, though it initially inspired it. I ended up running away at 18 and skipped the country. That is o.k. My usage of it is very much in the biblical sense. Even to this day, what makes HS so strong is that it kept on coming up. var part2 = "mansonblog.com"; Ask Van Houten. At least ONE Black man personally died in the jungles of Vietnam so HE could get a FREE Blow-Job. This marriage too did not prove to be stable and Linda Kasabian returned to stay with her mother in New Hampshire. [Off course he goes adding a third objection. The good guys are the victims, the bad guys are the killers. In that case, Helter Skelter, even to this day, still STIMULATES the economy which is STILL a good thing, in a capitalist society. A Conversation with Johnny Ussery- The Then 7 year old son of Clyda Dulaney! Like how about BILL Clinton. She answered the follow up question and confirmed her understanding of the arrival time. In fact, if I recall correctlyI believe she said earlier to her attorneys they went back to the ranch. A second marriage to an Armenian-American hippie named Robert Kasabian, who she met in Boston, followed in 1967. These weren't and aren't good people. (One) - $5 bill; serial #J35728714.3. She need only repeat his words. Kids who got in trouble in school and did not finish high school- and most of them don't go on to become murderers. ORWHUT: Very perceptive. There are several occasions where he brings out testimony he doesn't need for a conviction just to make her look good. St Circumstance saidOk- Ill be devils advocate. Where does light fusion into anything with Linda?As far as I'm concerned, every human being has something about them that is positive while at the same time being a container of darkness, regardless of the degree. Which has always left it an open ended mystery as to what Charlie told him. Especially against a man you think is Jesus Christ.I fully believe the tape with Marvin Part was a hogwash act in order to plead not guilty by reason's of insanity. Clear and simple, murder. Linda was instructed to go back to the front gate and stand guard while the others went into the residence. Linda Kasabian was born Linda Drouin on June 21, 1949 in Biddeford, Maine. In 1968, the couples first daughter Tanya was born. I believe her when she says that she was not worried about Tonya's actually being in danger. Dostie Demonstrates Buster Alerting at Barker Ranch! Back then nashua was a small town in nh.Also i personally talked to someone who picked her up hitchiking in nh the 70s.He said she was pregnant must of been her second child. And nothing she said could ever be used against her co~defendants.and Leslie lined up right behind her to do the same by puttin' on the crazy brainwashed actYou frequently say this even though it is frequently pointed out to you that this simply isn't the case and demonstrably so. Grim, I should have been more specific, my bad, I hope I am learning, here. I meant that they claim to know the "Real motive" My apologies George. Over here in England, working as a care assistant in a home for the elderly is not really seen as particularly caring work much of the time, it's often seen as a job anyone can do that wants to earn definite {low} money and the overwhelming majority of care workers I've known have not been native to these shores. But here you go. When her second marriage, to Armenian American Robert Kasabian, began to sour, Kasabian and her baby daughter, Tanya, returned to New Hampshire to live with Linda's mother. BUT Bugliosi said she (only she oddly) thought it was a creepy crawl mission. But I rereading my post above I do feel regret. Kasabian Thought for the Day: If Watson is attacking Voytek.."And while this was going on, the man had gotten up, and I saw Tex on top of him, hitting him on the head and stabbing him, and the man was struggling,"And Krenwinkel is chasing Abigail"then I saw Katie in the background with the girl, chasing after her with an upraised knife,"And this is was happening thirty feet outside the door.. "And then Sadie came running out of the house, and I said, "Sadie, please make it stop." St Circumstance saidIf you read this post and think Linda is someone to pity and use positive phrases for, or defend- that is coolIt's more a case of trying to examine all the angles and conclude based on the myriad differences one finds therein. He reinforced it was alright to act on the dangerous impulses this particular assortment of people had. Meanwhile, the ranch was raided and everyone was arrested on auto theft charges. After her sophomore year she dropped out to marry Robert Moses Peaslee. :). Their involvement in the murders was soon discovered. That's why anything said after a leading question should be tossed in the waste binDo you mean by the jury ?Do you feel Judge Older was somewhat derelict in his duty by letting so many leading questions go through ?So I'm not trying to prove Kasabian is actually lying. But NOW, "drunkenness" is considered to be the by-product of a DISEASE. It came up from a variety of sources, some of whom weren't even in the Family. Groups like the Revolutionary Youth Movement- Weather Underground and precursors to the SLA like those in the Revolutionary Union who support the strategy of urban warfare espoused by people like H Bruce Franklin and the leadership of Venceramos (sp?) Sanctimonious, elitist narcissist is more like it. Why ?Lo' and be hold, Bugliosi had a perfect scenario to answer this very important questionYou make it sound like he made it up ! Linda married again, this time to a hippie named Robert Kasabian. Not even in her Grand Jury testimony did Atkins say anything. I did know that that was, the plan was to murder two women inside the house. Leslie told Marvin Part what she believed.Marvin Part thought she was mad.Part taped her and asked her questions that brought the very answers that had led him to the conclusion she was a lunatic.Part wanted the Judge to hear the tape but he refused and ordered 3 psychiatrists to listen to it to see if they felt she was fit to stand trial.Leslie herself refused to be examined by any psychiatrists because as far as she was concerned she was perfectly sane.Leslie fired Marvin Part.The events mash rather than bear out your assertion.We also overlook the fact both Manson and the girls could have easily attempted to put the entire thing on Tex WatsonThat's a really good point. If, however, Atkins testifies he is in the same position he was with Kasabian testifying and, yes, he still needs corroboration but I wasn't going to try to 'try' that case here. Now is the time + (2.) Squeaky Fromme, David K Frazier. var part3 = "Matt at Mansonblog dot com"; Manson Blog Locates and Interviews Son of Clyda Dulaney! When she started testifying, immunity was not a foregone conclusion. Thank you for this post- very interesting and thought provoking. However, problems between the young couple led Linda and Tanya back to New Hampshire. She told Richard Caballero that on LaBianca night, there were to be 2 death squads. I liked your book and you- but don't agree with your conclusions :). document.write(part3 + ''); The young couple moved west last New Year's. A daughter, Tanya, is living with relatives in New Hampshire. In a sense, Helter Skelter and Susan Atkins developed as parallel lines during the investigation. ?Most definitely.Both were at different stages and had come through different experiences.However.there were also some similarities. If you read this post and think Linda is someone to pity and use positive phrases for, or defend- that is cool as the other side of the pillow. Given that she says all this in more or less the same group of sentences {in Robert's book}, which is it ? She's the black loving, anti-racism alternative. There wasn't enough room in the car for Cappy to go, so WHY didn't SHE just hitch a ride down to the hamburger stand, slit a throat and steal some fries ? It Gets Charlie off the hookWhile getting Charlie off the hook may be paramount for "Charlie supporters" I've found piles more people who are not Charlie supporters, indeed, people who can't stand him or that think he's a shitbag and are quite happy for him to remain in or die in jail, that believe that HS is wrong.In fact, far more people think it's wrong than do, in my on line experience. How does Linda represent the "Human" side of the Manson story?? ?Here, here! ITS REALLY TOO BAD!! He wasn't even charged with shooting Lotsapoppa, but we all know it happened..The question: what if she was ASKED?She wasn't asked, she was told. Her marriage later fell apart. It doesn't really matter. And I find it hard to believe that Bugliosi was so stupid as to not check either, knowing that his case would be seriously compromised if it came out that LK had no valid licence.Incidentally, it was Bugliosi and Bugliosi alone that speculated that the the only reason Linda was along both those nights was because she was the only one left with a valid driving licence, being that Mary was in the clink. There have also been a number of stories of the appalling way some care workers have treated the residents so this has also unfairly soured their general image in the minds of many. The question: what if she was ASKED? and the reward]A. I cannot say a definite time because, as I said before, I had no concept of time when I was there. And then I said, "People are coming." tobin james the blend 2017 ; real estate marketing solutions; linda kasabian daughter tanya; lassi kefalonia shops linda kasabian daughter tanya They were both into really wild shit long before meeting Charlie. What does that refer to ? Early Life. Anyone?Or..to paraphrase others: Life is going to knock you on your ass from time to time. Bob was living in Topanga Canyon with a man named Charles Melton. WOW! The "They had really bad backgrounds and nowhere else to turn" sympathy is appropriate in cases like Diane Lake and Ruth. very young, and not absent- but actually encouraging and contributing to the delinquency of their kids type of parents.But not Linda. Dreath saidI think there is a tendency to look at Kasabian's involvement through the lens provided by what we know (or believe or have been told to believe ) from where we sit todayThere's a lot of truth in that. people who assert their opinions as biblical truths.I am not picking on him, but just by way of example, Saint said."The real Losers in this entire sage are the victims and their families".First of all, no offense but that is a "duh" statement to the point of being a cliche.Second, it is said that you can't compare pain any more than you can compare love. The twenty-year-old girl was arrested in New Hampshire yesterday on a fugitive warrant for Los Angeles police who want to question her in connection with the murder of . All the stuff we're interested in wasn't of such weighty consideration for a jury that wanted facts about who did what and why and were they guilty ?And there are times her testimony 'just don't make no sense'There were times when Kanarek's questions just made no sense ! "Also as stated somewhere earlier, it didn't need some bogus story about a Lebanese actor to cover any Linda murder mania, not when 2 of the murderers had previously told police and other witnesses that she hadn't killed anyone.Given that no one was charged with even the attempted murder of or conspiracy to murder Saladin Nader, one might have to conclude you're chucking exhibits from that box of red herrings again Vincent Bugliosi said the only reason Linda went along on those two nights, is because she was the only one out of the group with a valid driver's license. During her eighteen days testimony, she was under immense pressure. Low level of intelligence: thinking a socialist was going to turn the United States into an idealist utopia where college was free, black people got reparations and Marijuana grew wild for all to partake. AKA: Linda Christian, Yana the Witch, Linda Chiochios. )I don't see her as having a personality disorder, just a consistently lawless mindset, which doesn't invalidate her ability or sometime willingness to do what is right. How do we know she didn't take part in some act of violence?Lo' and be hold, Bugliosi had a perfect scenario to answer this very important question and yet, when one looks at where that apartment was, it seems like another kill two birds with one stone job. I think it gives some fairly revealing insights into Kasabian's personality (disorder?) BUT even self-hate can have positive results and be a driving force for good.Supposedly there has been ONLY one person planted on this earth who was ALL good, but even HE committed assault & battery on "innocent" victims. I remember reading it over at the now dearly departed Cat's site. I gotta disagree with you on that one. Indeed, Tex has cleared Susan of stabbing Sharon Tate, while Pat cleared up the mystery of who carved WAR on Leno LaBianca and Tex has subsequently revealed he coerced Leslie into doing "something" {which is not to in any way diminish her responsibility}.But nothing regarding Linda, except the penalty phase debacle which all the main players have since admitted was lies and rubbish. In case anyone is wondering, any reports of Manson's death are at this point to be considered exaggerated. That is exactly what Leslie Van Houton was charged and CONVICTED forYeah, despite Bugliosi saying in his closer:"One thing is abundantly clear. If I point all these out here I won't have things to post in the future ;-). Truancy? Because her fashions were different. The two traveled the country, enjoying the hippie lifestyle from commune to commune. Early on at least however, Atkins was under the impression that doing whatever Tex told them to do meant "Charlie has instructed, OK'd and ratified this. Now I wonder IF her previously hidden past was NOT fairly typical for many young folks brought up in almost meaningless environments all across America and beyond its borders.AND now look at Donald Trump's legal "draft dodging" exploits and how THEY are going to lead to the EXPOSURE of many notable "closet cowards" amongst our sacred "establishment." I thought this one was DebS !Your posts are generally good thought provokers. The short youtube is anecdotal but a number of photos show troops of the 7th Cav in the battle of I-Drang valley. Some folk are just simply born under a bad sign, cursed with to much anger, desperation and bad judgement in their DNA. Fits her personality (disorder?). She was last reported to be living with Tanya in Washington State. You believe she was largely an accurate witness. March 1970 to Linda Kasabian, father unknown. Linda Darlene Kasabian was born on June 21, 1949. are with us in spirit if not in direct alliance. Manson himself went inside and tied the victims and then left along with her and few others instructing the rest of the family members to kill them. ?This is a girl who started breaking laws at a very young age. ' kill the white man'. So that's who I listen to. You said Kreneinkle said it. You are trained, instead, to focus on "indicia of credibility and reliability". St Circumstance saidThey have a need for HS to be wrong. She kept away from media attention except for once when she agreed to do an interview for an American television program A Current Affair in 1988. Even if she was alone for as long as 2 or 3 minutes, a pregnant, tied, tired, scared {described by Atkins as "going out of her mind"} Sharon wasn't The Fugitive on TV who would take the first possible opportunity to effect escape.From the confusion that all of the perps have spoken of that night, what I've gleaned is that we have all the details of what happened at Cielo but the order of events has never been clear after Jay was shot. I think we agree again. With the events leading up to the TLB murders, one is very naive to think the trip to Venice was just for no real reason. Both were at the Spahn Ranch near Chatsworth, stronghold of the 35-year-old Manson's nomadic cult of young people. She sounds very laconic and flat. ]MR.KANAREK: He is arguing with the witness, your Honor. Those who became 18 before 1980. Dreath saidI have for the past many years looked at these crimes from the prospective of how I might have handled the defense. Even with all the people that eventually formed part of the huge patchwork needed to make Manson's role make sense, without an Atkins, a Van Houten, a Krenwinkel, a Watson or a Kasabian, the case was so limp and that's why people would say to the prosecution things like "shame you had to be landed with such a bummer !". I didn't perceive you as the problem. Maybe the pity you have for Linda- who walked away free (That She blew it is her own fault)- would be better served to the people affected by what she helped do??? He said something to the effect that Charlie had a very strong case and that there was pretty much no evidence against him. Ruth's Mum wasn't in agreement with Dean and his changes. What appeared peaceful at first to Linda Kasabian turned violent. :-), "When they go low- I get high"or something like that lol. That makes Ms. Kasabian (as the key witness) a bit of pet project of mineWhat sort of things would you have done that weren't done by the defence ?There are multiple times where her testimony is not supported by the physical (objective) evidence Can you enumerate some of them ? After talking to a social worker, Linda returned to Los Angeles and eventually got her daughter back. How's that? You said Krenwinkle said it. Manson wasn't talking. It should also lead us directly to Charles Manson (a loving father to HIS Family and a Natural Born KILLER to many others.Like no other time in History, WE are discovering new facts concerning just what makes the Human Brain tick and hopefully it won't be much longer until WE finally understand exactly why human beings do the "terrible" things THEY do.AND of course, that understanding will eventually lead to a sense of awareness in humans paralleled in all of history. When you get to the heart of it, it is Bugliosi who says the motive was HS (+ megalomania+ anti-social hatred of the establishment+ lust for murder depending on when). She kept a lookout during the Tate-LaBianca murders, but didn't participate. Reportedly given up for adoption (Although she kept her other children from her husband). Granted, Dean Moorehouse was the kind of Dad that I'd like to jail for a very long time, notwithstanding acid blitzing his being, but it would appear that Ruth had some things going on within her that weren't vastly different to Linda. The only possible explanation, is that on that particular day she forgot it back on the ranch and only brought her library cardIt's not the only possible explanation. Leslie and Linda did not grow up any worse than thousands of other kids. So that's some good analysis Mother Kasabian. That's 3 times in a week. They have all said that. Dreath saidWhen you get to the heart of it, it is Bugliosi who says the motive was HS (+ megalomania+ anti-social hatred of the establishment+ lust for murderIt starts as being the other way around, HS being last on the list. Linda and Robert had a daughter named Tanya in 1968. There is simply no hard and fast rule for this. Credible doesn't always equal reliable and vice versa. The other day you were hating on people who never killed one single communist or burned one village, because they used their draft deferrments to wait out the war. Look at what Malcolm X had said and look at what the Black Panthers are saying in 1969. Do I give weight to what anyone says after they were convicted: Not much. The brackets are my comments. That is cover something up, replace it with something dramatic to help my case.Bug said Linda wasn't involved in any trouble prior to being at Spahn, yet he forgets she did admit to dealing drugs. 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